A little over a month ago, the pools placed Fernando Grande-Marlaska (Bilbao, 1962) outside the Government. They failed again. In a few weeks he will become the Interior Minister who has remained in office the longest after Sánchez once again supported him. He closes the year with the “great objective” that his department set during the Spanish presidency of the EU: achieving the 27 migration pact.
Is the agreement reached the one you would have liked to sign six months ago?
It was one of the top priorities of the Ministry of the Interior during the Spanish presidency of the EU. It is not the pact that I would have wanted, but I like it because it is an agreement of the 27 countries on an issue as sensitive as immigration, which has been an important element of division in recent years. I would not have accepted a pact that was not respectful of human rights.
Vice President Yolanda Díaz assures that it is a step backwards, which opens her hands to the agenda of the extreme right in Europe.
It is a step forward because before there was nothing: we have a migration pact in which for the first time there is talk of solidarity. And with scrupulous respect for human rights. The external dimension is addressed with the countries of origin and transit; Not only in the fight against mafias that traffic in human beings, lives are also saved by avoiding 40% of irregular departures.
How will Spain adapt to apply the pact?
Spain is one of the most prepared countries. He is an outstanding student. The crisis regulation will help so that complex transitional circumstances, such as we have experienced in the Canary Islands, are addressed in a co-responsible manner by the EU. Not only in Spain. This migration pact will also avoid situations like those in Lampedusa.
The country that does not want to help by welcoming its quota of applicants will have to pay 20,000 euros for each person it does not welcome. How does this measure fit with the concept of solidarity?
No, all European partners, all 27, have the obligation to cooperate. Another issue is flexible solidarity. Those countries that cannot assume the commitment to relocate migrants assume another form of collaboration, which is by financing projects that will favor the fight against mafias in third countries.
NGOs criticize the 7-day period to classify migrants because it can turn into prolonged detentions. Will we see border detention centers in Spain?
There is no possibility of violation of any fundamental right. And even less about people in vulnerable situations. As for the centers, the border procedure does not require that there be any holding center. The only thing that is required is that the applicant be available to the authority that processes the international protection file.
Italy intends to build centers in Albania to deport immigrants.
The Albanian Constitutional Court has suspended the agreement. Migration policy is an EU policy; It is not a policy of each country. Let no one doubt that every agreement implies absolute respect for fundamental rights.
He has referred to third countries of origin and transit. Let’s talk about them. Is Morocco still a reliable partner?
Morocco has always been a reliable partner; We have brotherhood relations developed over time. Of maximum loyalty, in both senses.
And why does Rabat resist reopening customs in Ceuta and Melilla, as signed?
I don’t think he resists compliance, but rather that all agreements take time. It is not due to any lack of will.
One of the highest points of the Senegalese cayucos crisis coincided with the unlocking of European aid to Tunisia. Are you aware that the Senegalese authorities have felt aggrieved?
Our cooperation with Senegal is extraordinary. It is an exceptional job. We have a team there from the National Police and the Civil Guard with a ship and a maritime surveillance plane. This is developing; there hasn’t been any change. That circumstance has had nothing to do with it, but rather internally in Senegal.
Elections are being held soon in Senegal. Will this influence the influx of boats on the Canary Islands route?
Migration is here to stay and what we have to address is to address irregular migration. The destabilization in Africa is causing many people to abandon their places of life. This requires a comprehensive response; what we call “advancing frontiers.” That people don’t need to go out. Since 2018 we have been transferring that need; The external dimension is supported in the pact.
Diplomatic relations with Algeria have been reconstituted, but in times of crisis, are you aware that it has used immigration as a political weapon?
Clearly not; I refer to the statistics of irregular entries originating from the Algerian coasts. I would even say that it has decreased. Relations in terms of border control are excellent and it is also excellent in terms of security.
You who belong to the judicial career, how are you experiencing the clash between the Executive and the Judicial Branches?
There is no clash between the Executive and the Judiciary. Sorry to disagree. The judicial branch, made up of more than 5,500 judges who hand down sentences every day, is an example of independence and impartiality: the basis of the rule of law.
Do you think that Junts, ERC or EH Bildu are going too far in their accusations against the Judiciary? Does lawfare exist in Spain?
There is no lawfare in Spain. Spanish judges fulfill their duties with strict compliance with the legal system in parameters of independence and impartiality.
So, when the judge of the National Court considers that the cause of the Tsunami is terrorism, do you think it is an excess or is it part of the instruction?
Judicial rulings are there to be respected. All of them. When the cases have not been definitively judged, we must still be more cautious in their assessment.
Do you see a risk that the protests in Ferraz have lit a fuse of violence that could spread as the amnesty law is processed?
Spanish society is aware that we have taken a risk. Society will not accept these absolutely unacceptable behaviors. Not only in Ferraz, but throughout Spain. This was provoked by political statements. You have to be very careful in what you say because they can cause a problem in the streets.
Vox does not seem to have made the same reading…
I hope that parties like Vox realize that Spanish society does not accept that type of political behavior that can lead to what we have seen on the streets; which is a society of intolerance that the vast majority of us do not like.
Will there be an opportunity this legislature to reform the gag law? Are you open to banning the use of rubber balls?
We made an important effort in the last legislature to reform the Citizen Security law, especially in some of its aspects such as the right of assembly and association. We did an extraordinary job that was finally frustrated by demands that were not appropriate. It’s still in our program; It is a priority objective, but always combining a balance between the defense of fundamental rights with an essential guarantee for the State security forces and bodies to carry out their work. That balance is essential.
A month ago, Minister Bolaños assured that the Interior was going to process the request for an escort for former president Carles Puigdemont. Are you going to do it?
A report has been requested from the State Attorney’s Office and we are awaiting receipt.
In August 2018, when you were already a minister, the Legal Profession was already asked for a report on this matter and you defended that it was not appropriate. Why are you asking for it again?
There is a request submitted by the government of Catalonia and we have considered it appropriate and appropriate that there be a report. Every time there is a request, there is a report. The reports must be updated or ratified where appropriate, but always the report accompanied at the time of the request.
If the State Attorney’s Office is in favor, will it be processed?
We will assess all the concurrent circumstances. What there is no doubt is that any decision that is adopted will be in strict compliance with the legal system, in parameters of absolute legality.
A historic claim of the independence movement is the transfer of the building of the National Police Headquarters of Catalonia, on Via Laietana. Are you willing to sit down and negotiate it?
I am not aware that the transfer is being requested. I will say one important thing: it is not on the table, far from it. And if we go to the bottom of the matter: the buildings where heinous crimes were committed in these 40 years are being resignified by all public officials; be they civil guards, national police or civil servants of the State, who are working with scrupulous respect for human rights and fundamental freedoms. That is the greatest proof of resignification of any building; not only about one in particular, about which I am asked, but about the many buildings where, unfortunately, human rights were systematically violated during a dictatorship.
Weeks ago, almost all the pools gave him outside of the Interior. Did you see yourself becoming the longest serving minister next month?
Well, a month ago, a year… and two, they also saw me outside.
And why do you think this is so?
Don’t know. Once appointed minister, the next step you have is to leave. And that will take place when the President of the Government understands that another team must occupy the Ministry. But as long as I have the confidence of the president, I will have all the energy and strength to continue working to benefit the security of society as a whole.
